You may never have heard of Bishop Bill Hamon, but you should know who he is. This man (pictured here with his wife, Evelyn) is one of the most influential “prophets” in the apostolic-prophetic movement, which has entered many charismatic churches — the fastest-growing churches in the world according to church growth researchers.
Hamon’s also one of the most influential charismatics in general — attending the invitation-only “Charismatic Leaders Council,” sponsored by Strang Communications (publisher of Charisma magazine), Jan. 15-16, in Lake Mary, Florida. Yet, Hamon’s teachings are some of the most unorthodox teachings in the church today.
Hamon’s Teachings
Hamon teaches that Christ can’t return to earth until Christians form a “militant” army — under the leadership of modern apostles and prophets — that will physically subdue the earth and start to establish God’s kingdom in the earth’s governments. Hamon compares this army to the Crusaders, who he describes as the church’s only bright lights during the Dark Ages.
God’s end-times army will achieve victory, in part, by striking God’s enemies with blindness and calling down natural disasters on them — causing entire nations to convert to Christ, according to Hamon. The apostles and prophets will be so powerful that Christians who come into their presence with sin in their lives will be struck dead. All members of the army will become sinless and extremely powerful — as they become more and more enlightened through new doctrines given by the apostles and prophets — finally attaining their own immortality (this is Hamon’s unorthodox take on the rapture). See these teachings in Hamon’s book Apostles, Prophets and the Coming Moves of God (pictured here).
Hamon’s Influence in the Apostolic-Prophetic Movement
The apostolic-prophetic movement’s most prominent leader may be C. Peter Wagner (pictured here). Yet, Wagner admits that he got many of his views from Hamon, calling Hamon one of his “closest prophetic colleagues” and confessing his great admiration for Hamon (see page 11 of Wagner’s book Changing Church and the foreword Wagner wrote to Hamon’s book Apostles, Prophets and the Coming Moves of God).
Many in the apostolic-prophetic movement regard Hamon as one of the most influential “prophets” today, and those who’ve endorsed his books include Oral Roberts, Tommy Tenney, Cindy Jacobs, Emanuele Cannistraci, David Cannistraci, Earl Paulk and Ed Silvoso.
Background on Bill Hamon
As the founder and bishop of Christian International Ministries Network based in Santa Rosa Beach, Florida, Hamon oversees over 600 churches in 19 countries (see the list here), and he’s authored several books that have been influential in the apostolic-prophetic movement, including Prophets and Personal Prophecy (pictured here). He conducts popular seminars that teach people how to prophesy. (I attended one at the Azusa Street Centennial in Los Angeles last April, and the line of people went out the door. His questionable methods for “activating” people into prophetic gifting are topics for another post.) He also founded Christian International School of Theology, from where he earned his own two degrees: a bachelor of theology and a master of theology. According to his Web site, he also was awarded an honorary doctor of divinity degree in 1973 from an unnamed “national university,” which was when he assumed the title “Dr. Hamon.”
Hamon also serves on the faculty of the Wagner Leadership Institute, based in Colorado Springs, Colorado.
Prophet-Apostle Hamon
In addition to the titles “Bishop” and “Doctor,” Hamon calls himself “Prophet-Apostle.” In fact, he believes God has chosen him to restore doctrines that the church lost through the ages and to reveal new doctrines and final assignments.
Many of Hamon’s doctrines can’t be found in the Bible — but this doesn’t concern Hamon, who teaches that modern “apostles” and “prophets” give the church new doctrines that supplement those given by the original apostles and prophets. In Apostles, Prophets and the Coming Moves of God, Hamon says:
“He [Paul] also reveals that this anointing for divine revelation was not just given to the prophets of old but has now been equally given to Christ’s Holy Apostles and Prophets in His Church” (page 140).
This teaching — that new doctrines are needed to supplement Scripture — is a mark of the cults of Christianity, like Mormonism. In contrast, Protestants believe that Christians get their teachings from the Bible alone, which God revealed through the original prophets and apostles.
Hamon’s New Doctrines vs. the Bible
While Hamon claims that his new doctrines supplement Scripture, they also contradict it. The revelations given by the apostle John in the biblical book of Revelation, for example, teach that the judgments against the wicked will be brought by God, not Christians, and that the rapture will be God’s means of sparing Christians from the effects of those judgments, not a means of attaining their own immortality.
‘Manifest Sons of God’ Doctrine
Hamon’s teachings are consistent with the heretical “manifest sons of God doctrine,” which teaches that a breed of super-Christians will arise and subdue the earth. Another common strain of this doctrine is that Christians are gods, whose divinity will be revealed — or using King James Language — be manifested. Read more about this doctrine here.
Supporters of this doctrine misapply the biblical teaching about the church being Christ’s body, using it to argue that the church actually becomes part of God. (See pages 266-267 of Hamon’s book Apostles, Prophets and the Coming Moves of God, where he seems to be misusing this teaching this way.) Also, in his books, Hamon capitalizes the words “Church” and “Bride” to show the church’s “union with Deity through Jesus Christ,” according to an explanatory note. Statements like these, which appear throughout Hamon’s materials, make it appear he is teaching that the church actually becomes part of God.
Of course, 2 Peter 1:4 does teach that we “participate in the divine nature,” but this refers to the Holy Spirit who indwells us, enabling us — as the passage goes on to state — to “escape the corruption in the world caused by evil desires.” It does not teach that our nature actually becomes divine. The teaching that human beings can become divine is the same lie that Satan told Eve in the Garden of Eden.
In light of these troubling teachings, Hamon’s influence on so many Christians today disturbs me. I plan to read more of his writings and discuss more of his teachings in future posts.
Spirit of Error 
Holly,
You stated:
“In light of these troubling teachings, Hamon’s influence on so many Christians today disturbs me. I plan to read more of his writings and discuss more of his teachings in future posts.”
I understand your feelings.
It should disturb us. Just as when a man’s influence causes people to search for the antichrist more than seek the True Christ.
But maybe instead of reading Hamon’s writings we should stick with Christ’s???
It seems that to some there is a devil and a conspiracy behind everything?
a person that sometimes comments here on your blog went as far as to say that God had killed the young man in waco because he was part of the emergent church??? give me a break.
false teaching does disturb me, but also those who cant rest until they expose the person disturbs me as well.
“rebuke and expose the unfruitiful works of darkness.”
“Know those who labor among you.”
“For such are false apostles, deceitful workers,transforming themselves[they appoint themselves gk.] into apostles of Christ
“By their fruits you shall know them.”
These men are “ministers of righteoussness.”But,they “transform themselves”as such.
“And their end shall be according to their works.”‘Rebuke the works of darkness’ and heresy.
People need to “STUDY to show themselves approved unto God rightly dividing the Word of Truth.” ll Tim.3:15
It is the charismatic movement that gave us these – doctrinal uneducated in true Bible doctrine (that was “once for all forever gk. delievered to the saints.”Jude the Lord’s foster brother)freaks of darkness and false teaching, which Paul and the apostles railed against.They must stop it!!!
It will get out of hand and Waco will be a picnic compared to these guys!
In the last days ‘they[‘believers’] shall heap to themselves[to ‘themselves’ again!] teachers because they have a desire to hear[“itching ears”gk.]these teachers.’because of the bend[or they are twist gk.]that is in their own minds.’
We conservative Christains already fight against these false teachers,but the Charismatics must take a firm hand as you note Paul said it would be the weird believers wanting to hear such teachings-they have “itching ears”,etc.,because of a ‘twist’ (gk.) in their minds.
In the ‘last days’ they would welcome these nutty(and they are certainly not the poster children for mental health!),but evil teachers of false antibiblical doctrines.
you bring up some good points Herb….and I think Holly is obeying Christ when she exposes false teaching and she certainly appears to be reading His words (as you suggest)
Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. Acts17:11
I want to thank you Holly and encourage you for exposing these heratics and thier false teachings. I read your newest blog report about Bill Hammon, I would strongly recommend anyone who reads this and follows Bill Hammon, they need to get away from this person and his false teachings, their is no where in Scripture that states anyone will be made perfect here on earth as we all have a sinful nature Romans 3:10….(NKJV) ” there is none rightoue, no, not one” (NKJV) Romans 3:23 ” for all have sinned all fall short of the glory of God” (NKJV). Bill Hammon would be wiser to confess his sins 1 John 1:9, repent of his sins and ask The Lord into his heart, if he does not he will have no excuse when he stands before Our Lord on judgement day to be cast into the lake of fire Revelation 20:11-15.
In Christ
Dave
Holly,
Glad to see that someone is writing about these things. I work at a large church that is located about an hour away from a CIMN church. I am frequently asked “why shouldn’t I go there to receive ‘prophetic prayer’?” I have not read all of Hamon’s materials, but enough to concur with your assessment.
Keep it up!
In His love
Sue
david,
have you ever spoken with bill harmon personally?????
I have gone to this church many times.
No Time To Waste Says:
March 19th, 2007 at 9:32 am
david,
have you ever spoken with bill harmon personally?????
Hello whoever you are: I do not need to speak to this man, his writings tell the story. The Lord gives us His Holy Spirit to discern these things and so I will trust The Bible, My Savior and His Holy Spirit in all things. Bill is a heratic as proved by his own works. I would think any Bible believing saved person would never want to argue with Thier Lord Jesus, yet as is proven people will defend false teachings and thier teachers yet never trust nor defend Jesus and His Word The Bible. Which of course leads to wonder if they are saved at all.
I would strongly recommend anyone who reads this and follows Bill Hammon, they need to get away from this person and his false teachings, their is no where in Scripture that states anyone will be made perfect here on earth as we all have a sinful nature Romans 3:10….(NKJV) ” there is none rightoue, no, not one” (NKJV) Romans 3:23 ” for all have sinned all fall short of the glory of God” (NKJV). Bill Hammon would be wiser to confess his sins 1 John 1:9, repent of his sins and ask The Lord into his heart, if he does not he will have no excuse when he stands before Our Lord on judgement day to be cast into the lake of fire Revelation 20:11-15.
Choose today who you will serve Jesus or Bill the choice is yours!!!
In Christ
Dave
Dave….
you stated….
“Which of course leads to wonder if they are saved at all.”
This is a typical trait that I have found in people that really enjoy blasting other ministries. they find someone that disagrees with them and then begins to question their salvation. the only thing smells of i am better than you. like i said in another post… i am not against speaking out against false prophecy and false teaching…. i am just against this method…. i personally think its weak. holly posted scripture under “name calling” that i totally agree with. where she misses it….. this is not a church or a church body.
i am simply concerned that if all of the judgment coming against so many ministries is more toward the ministry than it is concern for the individual that might fall into those false teachings.
Hi Holly!
I recently found your site.
My christian growing backround is from neopentecostalism, so i´m very interested in know more besides my church teaching. So it´s very helpful your site.
Would you give me your email to write you something?
Blessings form Mexico
I am in agreement with what you have shared here.
Bill Hamon, his heretical teachings and his influence on the apostelic movement and it’s followers are a huge concern.
Here is what I believe. not just because of the Word, and my own discernment but because what I have experienced first hand.
This warped “crusader mentality” is alive and well and growing in strength. It is their way or the highway, and in the future anyone who calls themselves a follower of Christ who speaks against them will not only be falsely labeled a heretic but also treated as such were centuries ago. Though that time of such extremes has not arrived quite YET.
We may speak in love [with firmness] and truth, just as Christ did… but their often venomic, angry and unscriptural responses which try to “rationalize away the truth” show exactly what spirit is control of them… the same one that ultimately cried out “crucify Him” in Jesus’ day.
Just as Christ did, we must pray that God forgive them, and especially pray for them.
God knows that there are still some hearts open up to the truth. Some will actually have ears to hear the message you are trying to bring across here and see the light.
Great site, and a hard calling.. keep up the good work!
Hi Holly,
I am sending this because I like your blog. I think you are sincere and down-to-earth. I enjoy reading your articles. I do notice that all your references are to the NIV. After reading your articles I believe that you believe in what you are doing.
I have to believe that you are not aware of just how bad the NIV is. I could fill up pages. Many good men have explored this subject. I have copied some of this.
You are working to expose false doctrine and teachings in the Body of Christ. So I would ask you to consider a few things.
Deception is everywhere. It was not that many years ago we only had one bible. Now I think the count is 124. We went from the KJV to 124 bibles. And my count may be off a few.
The NIV is the most popular. It is called the International version because that is what the plans for it are. The International, anyone of any religion can use it, bible.
All the modern versions are based on Catholic manuscripts. So naturally you would expect to see works and not grace.
One of our Christain Doctrines is that if we except Christ as our Saviour we are saved. The Catholic believes they are saved at infant baptism, (not scriptual), and are being saved daily by their good works, (not scriptual).
In 1 Cor. 1:18 KJV Paul said “but unto us which are saved” . NIV “but to us who are being saved”.
Which is it? Are we saved or are we being saved? Can’t have it both ways. Many other examples
We see a lot of groups today who are more interested in bringing everybody together than they are in Doctrine. We see catholics and muslims and protestants and others all saying we have something in common. Forget your doctrine and lets dine together.
I noticed you quoted Amos 3:2 in the article “Defending Silence”. I wonder if the modern trends are caused by the NIV rendition of the truth.
Amos 3:2 KJV Can two walk together, except they be agreed? Now we know what that means. If you have different doctrine you can’t function together. In fact the second epistle of John says; 2John 10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
But what does Amos 3:2 in the NIV say? Do two walk together unless they have agreed to do so? Well, now according to the NIV, me and Osama can walk together simply by agreeing to do so. How nice.
New Agers today will tell you that Jesus and Satan are the same person. If they tell you that and you have the NIV don’t try to deny it. You won’t be able to.
Isaiah 14:12 in the KJV says that Lucifer fell from Heaven. The NIV changed that to the “Morning Star”. But in Rev 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, [and] the bright and morning star. We see that Jesus Christ is the Morning Star.
So in the NIV Jesus and Lucifer are the same person. And we wonder where people get these ideas.
In Christianity we have to have a Sinless Saviour. But not in the NIV.
Mat 5:22 KJV But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
Mar 3:5 And when he had looked round about on them with anger, being grieved for the hardness of their hearts, he saith unto the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched [it] out: and his hand was restored whole as the other.
It is amazing what you can do with three little words. Jesus Himself said in Mat 5:22 that if you are angry with your brother “without a cause” you are in danger of the judgement. In Mar 3:5 He is angry with His brother but He has cause to be, “the hardness of their hearts”. If He had no cause He would be in danger of the Judgement. A sinner.
The NIV has deleted those three little words, “without a cause” . Mat 5:22 NIV But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother, will be subject to judgement.
The NIV removes the blood of Jesus Christ!
COLOSSIANS 1:14: The KJB reads, “In whom we have redemption THROUGH HIS BLOOD, even the forgiveness of sins:” The NIV reads, “In whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.” The NIV rips out the precious words “THROUGH HIS BLOOD”! Friend, redemption is ONLY “THROUGH HIS BLOOD”. Hebrews 9:22, reads, “. . . without shedding of BLOOD is no remission.” That old song says, “What can wash away my sins, NOTHING BUT THE BLOOD OF JESUS!”
The NIV perverts The Lord’s Prayer into The Devil’s Prayer!
LUKE 11:2-4: The KJB reads, “. . .Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so in earth. Give us day by day our daily bread. And forgive us our sins; for we also forgive every one that is indebted to us. And lead us not into temptation; but deliver us from evil.” The NIV removes everything that refers to a Holy God in heaven -“WHICH ART IN HEAVEN. . . Thy will be done, AS IN HEAVEN, so in earth. . . but DELIVER US FROM EVIL.” Everything that distinguishes God from the Devil is REMOVED! “OUR FATHER” of the NIV is “NOT IN HEAVEN” and “DOES NOT DELIVER FROM EVIL!” I wonder who it could be? (hint: see John 8:44)
The NIV completely “TAKETH AWAY” 17 verses!
Wonderful and precious verses like:
MATTHEW 18:11: “For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.”.
ACTS 8:37: “And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.”
The NIV PERversion completely “TAKETH AWAY” Matthew 17:21, 18:11, 23:14, Mark 7:16, 9:44, 9:46, 11:26, 15:28, Luke 17:36, 23:17, John 5:4, Acts 8:37, 15:34, 24:7, 28:28, Romans 16:24 and 1 John 5:7!
After Mark 16:8 the NIV says, “The most reliable early manuscripts and other ancient witnesses do not have Mark 16:9-20.” ZAP-There goes another 12 verses! And by the way, that is absolutely untrue! The book, The Last Twelve Verses of the Gospel of Mark, by Dean Burgon contains over 400 pages of documented evidence for Mark 16:9-20, that has never been refuted, nor ever will!
After John 7:52, the NIV, reads, “The earliest and most reliable manuscripts and other ancient witnesses do not have John 7:53-8:11” ZAP-There goes another 12 verses!
Matt. 12:47, 21:44, Luke 22:43 and 22:44 are all removed in the footnotes!
That’s 45 complete verses the NIV removes from the text or in the footnotes!
The NIV “TAKETH AWAY” 64,576 words!
Don’t look for the “mercyseat” in the NIV – GONE!
Don’t look for “Jehovah” in the NIV – GONE!
Don’t look for the “Godhead” in the NIV – GONE!
The NIV removes wonderful Bible “terms” like remission, regeneration, impute, propitiation, new testament and many others!
Despite God’s clear warnings about “taking away” from His words – the NIV removes 64,576 words! Over 8 percent of God’s word is “TAKETH AWAY”!
That equals REMOVING the books of Ruth, Esther, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon, Lamentations, Hosea, Joel, Amos, Obadiah, Jonah, Micah, Nahum, Habakkuk, Zephaniah, Haggai, Malachi, Colossians, I Thessalonians, II Thessalonians, I Timothy, II Timothy, Titus, Philemon, James, I Peter, II Peter, I John, II John, III John, Jude and more – COMBINED!!! The equivalence of ripping out OVER 30 BOOKS of the Bible!
In case you think it’s insignificant words like “thee” and “thou”? The NIV removes major portions of at least 147 verses!
Here’s a small (very small) sampling of words removed in the NIV!
Matt. 6:13, “For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.”
Matt. 15:8, “This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth”
Matt. 19:9, “and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.”
Matt. 20:7, “and whatsoever is right, that shall ye receive.”
Matt. 20:16, “for many be called, but few chosen.”
Matt. 20:22, “and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with”
Matt. 25:13, “wherein the Son of Man cometh.”
Matt. 27:35, “that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet They parted my garments among them and upon my vesture did they cast lots”
Mark 6:11, “Verily I say unto you, it shall be more tolerable for Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.”
Mark 10:21, “take up the cross.”
Luke 1:28, “blessed art thou among women”
Luke 4:4, “but by every word of God”
Luke 4:8, “get thee behind me Satan”
Luke 4:18, “he hath sent me to heal the broken hearted”
Luke 11:2-4, “Our … which art in … Thy will be done, as in heaven so in earth… but deliver us from evil”
John 1:27, “is preferred before me”
John 3:13, “which is in heaven”
John 3:15, “should not perish”
John 11:41, “from the place where the dead was laid”
John 16:16, “because I go to the Father”
Acts 10:6, “he shall tell thee what thou oughtest to do”
Acts 15:18, “Known unto God are all his works”
Acts 20:24, “But none of these things move me”
Acts 23:9, “let us not fight against God”
Rom. 8:1, “who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit”
Rom. 13:9, “Thou shalt not bear false witness”
I Cor. 6:20, “and in your spirit which are God’s”
I Cor. 11:24; “Take eat… broken”
II Cor. 10:4, “but mighty through God”
Gal. 3:1, “that you should not obey the truth”
Eph. 5:30, “of his flesh, and of his bones”
Phil. 3:16, “let us mind the same thing”
I Tim. 6:5, “from such wthdraw thyself”
Heb. 7:21, “after the order of Melchisedec”
I Pet. 1:22, “through the Spirit”
I Pet. 4:14, “on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified”
I John 4:3, “Christ is come in the flesh”
I John 5:13, “and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God”
Rev. 1:11, “I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last”
Rev. 5:14, “him that liveth for ever and ever”
Rev. 14:5, “before the throne of God”
Rev. 21:24, “of them which are saved”
Jesus Christ says, in Luke 4:4, “. . . It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by EVERY WORD of God.” But not according to the NIV! In fact, the NIV even “TAKETH AWAY” the last half of Luke 4:4 – “BUT BY EVERY WORD OF GOD”! And Jesus Christ was quoting Deuteronomy 8:3 to Satan! Does the NIV PERversion seriously think the Lord Jesus Christ does NOT know Duet. 8:3???
There is a lot more but you get the idea.
God Bless
Dear Ron,
Thank you for your encouraging words about my blog! I also appreciate you taking the time to share your concerns about the NIV with me. It is my understanding, based on what I’ve read from some of the leading Bible scholars of today, that the NIV and NASB and other new translations are based on older and more reliable manuscripts than the ones the KJV was based on. That’s not to say that the KJV isn’t a good translation, but the others are more faithful to the original manuscripts, according to the consensus of Bible scholars today. Here’s a link to a site operated by Dr. Daniel Wallace of Dallas Theological Seminary that explains why the newer translations are more reliable: http://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=665. Wallace is widely recognized as a leading Greek scholar.
Even the editor of the KJV (Erasmus, a Roman Catholic priest), in the preface to the original 1611 edition, acknowledged that, as more manuscript evidence became available, better translations than his could be made. He also acknowledged that the translation of the KJV wasn’t perfect and that even poor Bible translations still contain God”s word. See Wallace’s article on this here: http://www.bible.org/page.asp?page_id=1823
Also, I don’t believe any doctrines of the Bible are changed in the differing translations. No one reading the NIV would come to the conclusion, for example, that Lucifer and Jesus were the same (at least not a reasonable person). There is a lot about both Jesus and Lucifer throughout the Bible that makes it clear that they are on opposing sides.
I don’t think all religions would feel comfortable with the NIV since it teaches the gospel and all the other distinctly Christian doctrines. The blood of Christ is clearly taught in the NIV.
Here is another of Wallace’s articles called “The Conspiracy Behind the New Bible Translations”: http://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=706
Not only is the text of the KJV less reliable, but it is also very difficult for modern readers to understand. I don’t like to see unnecessary barriers put up between people and God’s Word.
Those are my quick thoughts. I hope you’ll look at the sources I linked to because I really believe that the King James Only-stance is unnecessarily divisive. Again, I appreciate your concern for me!
Hi Holly,
I knew a CI pastor in my area a number of years ago. I know from my short experience with that particular pastor that CI (at least this pastor did) focused heavily on Spiritual Warfare through intercession and Prasie and Worship.
These doctrines you speak of from Bill Hamon are very disturbing to learn of. I don’t want to go buy the book but would like to read the passages on the parts you mention (about the literal militant army).
Could you email me those quotes if it is not too much trouble. I would be intereasted to see what this pastor would say about this issue.
Any doctrine of this nature is very scary to think people can think they are serving God but be so far off base.
1. there is spiritual warfare
2. we do fight a fight and war a war
3. the high praise of God is like a two-edged sword
4. the enemy attacks us with words and thoughts
5. one of our weapons is the word… that we speak and declare
6. we are to pull down strong-holds and cast our arguments and imaginations.
7. we are to submit to God, resist the devil to make him flee
David Says:
April 16th, 2007 at 2:22 pm
Hello Everyone especially all my Brothers and Sisters in The Lord Jesus Christ: I will be brief. I have given allot of thought and prayer to what we all comment on good, bad or in between. I have decided that after prayer I am and so are most of us reacting to so many things on this blog. We are all in our minds and hearts to one degree or another right.
The point I am trying to make, would it not be wiser for all of us to stop trying to get points across about people and instead concentrate how we could encourage one another in The Word. I know that there are many false teachers and false works, yet do you not think it would be wiser to follow Jesus example and pray for people who we feel are in error of scripture Matthew 5:43-48. If they are wrong, The Lord will, as always, deal with them and thier works, He will deny them Matthew 7:21-23 and Romans 12:19-20. If we go even further we see His example on the Cross
Luke 23:34.
I can speak from personal experience here as I am as wrong as anyone else, and as Jesus also reminds us in Matthew 5:14-16 we are His light, the light of the world, and we are to shine for Him so as to glorify The Father in heaven.
I pray that we can turn Holly’s wonderful blog into an encouraging spirit filled site for one another. It would be so wonderful if others would read this blog and write comments like Trust in the Lord, I recieved Christ today, I was water baptised today, etc.
Thank you all and God Bless
Your Brother in The Lord
Dave
davidandsherri@pei.symapatico.ca
I currently attend a church that is aligned with WLI, and in the last few years I have seen and heard doctrines that at first puzzled me, but now cause me great concern.
For instance, using Matt 28:19 “Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost” as a justification for attempting to take dominion over cities, institutions, even countries etc when the verse plainly refers to people of various ethnic groups and NOT nation states.
One does not, nor cannot, baptize land masses.
It is this sort of misapplication of the Word of God that causes me concern.
In fact there are songs that I cannot in good conscience sing during services because they seem more like self-congratulatory anthems than praises to our God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.
Perhaps I am wrong, but at times I wonder where the burden for sinners has gone. Where is the awareness of sin? Where has sound doctrine gone?
It grieves me to realize that people I know and care for have bought into this new wineskin doctrine and that I will have to eventually leave a church I have attended (not always faithfully I must admit) for almost 15 years.
If I have to choose between agreeing with Wagner Leadership Institute doctrine and what’s written in the Bible, I will choose the Bible.
It’s words are the words of life.
I do not know what the words of the WLI and their kind are, but I am certain they are not the words that Jesus would have me hear.
in pursuit of the kingdom and discoering more of my prophetic calling i have come accross books written by the bishop hence would love to learn more and develop in the calling maturely.
would also would like to receive more infromation of the apostolic and prophetic school
I only inquired into a church associated with the Bishop. I never heard of him other wise.
The church appeared to be a short term ( 4-6 month) teaching institute.
I e mailed them about there courses.
http://www.extendedlife.net/schools_of_the_holy_spirit.htm
They sent me a recored tape that was incredibly prophetic. Past and current.
So, I know there is lots of weird doctrine floating around, but if these people were not true disciples of JESUS, there is no way they could of prophesied as they did.
Yes?
I am not a CI person. I just came back from the UK and listening to some CIEurope leaders. Their concern was Jesus, that His Name be preached, that anything that would separate them in their relationship with the Lord would be removed. Every year they spend days and weeks on their face before God, praying that everything that can be shaken will, asking God’s anointing on their schedule and what direction He would have them take, praying that God’s will would be done on earth (Mt.6:10) . Every day their lives are spent obeying whatever the Lord asks of them, even when they don’t want to do it (i.e. speaking to strangers when they just want to be with family, etc). Of course, the daily prayer is vital too, in addition to the yearly prayer for direction.
I have not met anyone who has truly been that surrendered to Christ and that courageous in their prayers. Most have a grocery list of personal favors to ask of the Lord and pretend they don’t hear Him when He “whispers in their ear a direction this way or that” (Isa.) when it is not the direction they want to go.
I do not know the ministry in FL but we are the body of Christ, told to take up armor and fight against the enemy (Eph 6), we are the bride of Christ, told to make ourselves ready for the return of the Bridegroom. I haven’t seen much in the actions of Christians (American anyway) that says I will forget what lies behind and run straight (without distraction) to see that God’s call is fulfilled on this earth.
What then? I’d suggest looking at the fruit of this ministry. Does it build up? Is there salvation of Jesus? Is there a littered trail of damaged people or churches? Do they ask of God things that reflect trust in a living, big God who can do more than we could ever ask or think or do they put God in a box and think He is not capable of the things scripture shows He is capable of? Are they afraid of popular opinion (Mt 10:28)? Are they into materialism or do they use the money they raise to reach more for the gospel (Mt 6:21). Basically, is the fruit that comes out of this ministry healthy or poor (Mt. 7:15-20)? If it is healthy then we need to get out of our armchairs and do something, though what we do is between ourselves and God, but I would not want to speak against something God is doing, no matter how we disagree with a vessel here and there.
It happened all the time in Jesus day, and the people who should have recognized the move as being of God, just sat and critiqued. In the words of Gamaliel (Acts 5:35-39) “…if what they have planned and done is of human origin, it will disappear, but if it comes from God, you cannot possibly defeat them. You could find yourselves fighting against God!” (Today’s English Version)
In these latter days God has called for unity, not separation so what are we truly seeking?
>but if these people were not true disciples of JESUS, there is no way they >could of prophesied as they did.
Nonsense. The devil and his minions can seem good at ‘prophesying’. The devil even quotes scripture rather well.
http://endtimespropheticwords.wordpress.com
The church is the Body of Christ. That is scriptural. In the beginning the destiny of man as stated in Genesis was to fill the earth and subdue it. When Christ died on the cross, he restored that to us so that we can indeed subdue the kingdoms and principalities, the spiritual hosts of wickeeness. If we were not in a war, why would Paul say take up the full armor of God? We go on the offensive with the sword of the Spirit, the word of God. Our struggle is not with flesh and blood. In Revelation it says the saints overcame the devil by the blood of Christ and the word of their testimony plus not loving their lives unto death. We can overcome evil principalites through what God has given us.
And may I remind you, the rapture is nowhere mentioned in the Bible. There is no clear teaching about how and when that will take place, only interpretations of men and they do not agree. This imagined scenerio peple have about the rapture is based on a vision a lady had in Scotland. And Dallas Schofiled put the theory in his Bible notes.
We are to occupy until Jesus comes, Jesus says. He says the Kingdom of heaven is something the violent take my force. The wicked could not be referred to here. They could not take the kingdom of God. The saints are the ones and again we must war to claim what belongs to us, what Christ has restored to us. It’s ours. But the devil won’t roll over and play dead.
The Bible declares Jesus is coming back for a Bride without wrinkld or spot. Positional righteousness and the degree we experience are different things, else why would Paul call the Corinthians carnal? Jesus is perfecting us even though in the Cross we are declared rightous. We still must war to walk as the children of God He has saved us to become.
I would like to receive some of your teaching materials since I do tap into the apostolic and prophetic ministry and I do preach about it. Please do send me some teachings articles of yours to help me enhance this move to those who don’t know it and are not in it.
This all happens because there is not a clear understanding about the Kingdom of God and how God works His goverment on earth. Also, there is stated in the book of Ephesians 4:11-13 “11It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, 12to prepare God’s people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ. ”
If people really understand all these, there would not be any confusion.
Unfortunatelly many selcalled and ordaind pastors, bishops, preachers, and others who claim be God’s followers have harmed the beliver’s mentality turning it into a religious mentality and not the Kingdom mentality as it was God’s intent. Genesis 1:26 clearly talks about mankind rulership (not ownership) of the earth to subdue it…
there are many books to read about, specially from people lke Myles Monroe, Hank and brenda Kunneman but most importantly the reading and understanding the Bible and having revelation upon it.
God bless and “repent” {matthew 4:14 =renew your mind, the way you think} because the Kingdom of Heaven has arrived
I hear alot of attacks here, attacking something you don’t know about!
Eph 4 says the are apostles, prophets, pastors teachers and evangelist.
Do I agree with everything every preacher says absolutly not!
Do I attack them absolutly not.
Why the controversy? The bible says to avoid it (look it up)
We all need to study, pray, and follow peace with all men. The bible says
without holiness no man will see the Lord. Judge not least you be judged!
Anonymous I’m in total agreement with you.
Enough of the slander of another brother in the the Lord.
If you feel he is in err, then prayer would be good. God is doing a new thing, can you not see it?
Hi
You should be a journalist (National Enquirer). Write a lot, condemn some, point to faults of others but cannot place meat on the plate. Bill Hammon….. Spirit of Error….Hammon’s new doctrine vs the Bible… Then we are referred to “read more about this doctrine of error”. Instead of condemning why not write facts to prove your points and confirm that what you say is sound. Right now, I can take as myth what you wrote as you did not present anything to prove your point. It is a sad state when someone condemn without justification. Is it a need to show superiority?
Thanks to the Lord that some persons refrained from negative comments for lack of facts but a sad a state for those who agrees with you without clear knowledge of the situation.
I have most and read most of his books and yes sometimes he stretches my mind but would not be ready to condemn for such and yes he could be possibly wrong and I might not be grounded enough in the Word to decipher what is false but at the same time had a lot of my questions answered by reading them. Instead of giving us your views why don’t you give us reference in his specific books and pages or even print a passage of what was said that is not in conformity with the Bible so that everyone can assess what you are presenting. Usually reference is given from any Pastor when giving a teaching or at least he should. I thought that by going to your reference “Read more about this doctrine of error” I would get something new but it was material to confirm your doctrine. Really I still do not know if it applies in this situation. I would be interested in specifically knowing the error(s) from his teachings as they could affect me. Many blessings to you.
It seems to mean it is always the case when the purpose of a thing is not understood abuse is inevitable.
I can see clearly that a lot of God’s people do lack great understanding of the Fathers eternal prupose for mankind, who He created in His Image.
The Kingdom government of God, is not a new doctrine or heresy. It is all about the rule of God on earth through His son’s He created in His Image. God does not expect us to live less than that, actually without the manifestation of the son’s of God, the whole world will be in darkness.
We should go to God to help us understand His plan and purpose.
remember “God does not think the way man thinks, neither does He sees things the way man sees things.
In His Light alone must we see light.
I believe the body of Christ need more light and revelation
Kingdom message is not new, that was all Christ Jesus preached and demonstrated, and He has promised, that we as believers we do the same work that He did, for as He is , so are we in this world.
All about the kingdom government of God is supernatural.
By the way the kingdom is righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Ghost.
Please study books by Dr. Munroe, to help throw more light on Kingdom issues.
I happen to know Bill Hamon personall and I know for sure that he is the real deal. I have attended his church (CI) all my life and I trust that man with my life. Be careful what you say about the Prophets!
Salutations and Greetings ,
On behalf of “THE LOVE” of God particularly what we have and do experience in Christ Jesus. Let me first say that any open conversation lends room for change and as importantly dialogue.
The book of Ephesians 4:11 clearly states that He gave some, apostles; some, prophets; and some, evangelist;and some pastors and teachers. (Ryrie/KJV)
I must confess initially I thought the Lord may have been stating this scripture from a historical positioning. That would be going along with many organized denominations who take the position that prophets were up until the time of Christ and apostles had to have seen Christ and experienced His Resurrection. The position regarding the apostles would also be one excepted by The Church of Christ ( having seen Christ, etc, etc).
This position does not however take into account that Paul from what we have read in the bible had an encounter with our Lord via His voice (Acts 9:3-6) that was not physical as in the person of CHRIST. What was so awesome was that it was a glorified (from Heaven) interaction with our Lord which is inclusive of seeing or relating to our Lord after His Resurrection. (Acts 9:17) Henceforth validation of Paul’s apostleship
Christ given authority. Question is have we in these last days and times been called as apostles in Christ as we know clearly that is what the ministry of Christ produces and Christ ministry alone.
I personally do not think anything is wrong with revelation as this could be considered understanding. (wouldn’t you agreed) The bible tells us that understanding comes from GOD. When we read the bible and the same glory that Paul experienced is made known to us in this realm of the flesh or physical senses isn’t that Jesus allowing us to see HIM through His glory , through the Spirit and through the invisible?
Why is it that we have accepted the portions of this scripture pastors,teachers, evengelists and deacons from the book of Timothy and not the others (apostles/prophets) . Is it because when we are trained up in a particular way we come up against great difficulty in our own minds when Christ himself often times is attempting to bring us fresh understanding (revelation if you will) from His Throne Room or better put from the Spirit or from above.
I mean not to offend anyone yet what I perceive is when you go to school
and trust me this is a schooling process we have been called into in CHRIST, the book of 2 Tim 2:15 tells us we are responsible for what we follow, have faith in or believe. That being said is it possible that each of us are positionally different places in our growth (relationship or conversion) in Christ and that one who has a elementary level of learning can not be expected to understand the next level of junior high, high school, college and so on. Let us remember that this is what Paul himself refers to when he states that some have need of milk (young christians) and others need of meat (more mature chrisitians).
This in fact is what the modern day pastors, doctors, bishops are in fact relaying to us that like the pharisees they know more than we do because we have not gone to their schools or we have not gotten what we have in the manner they got it therefore we are not valid. However, please let us be reminded that God or Christ if you will does the validating and more specifically Christ stated that my sheep know the sound of my voice and another they will not follow. We need ask ourselves today are we in fact following Christ or are we following man?
If you all want to stay in your state of tradition than go ahead, and guess what, I am going with Bill Hamon. My prayer is that your eyes be enlighten to what the Spirit of the Lord is saying to the Body of Christ, he that has an ear let him hear what the Spirit is saying to the church, may God bless all of you and open up your dark understanding. There is nothing wrong with Bill Hamon.
What total garbage you have written here. Not only have you managed to follow in the footsteps of the sons of Belial and the false witnesses in Scripture to totally misrepresent and misquote Dr. Hamon’s teachings, but you are obviously harboring a very critical and religious spirit in rejecting the truth. Not only have I read almost every one of Dr. Hamon’s books and supported his ministry for almost two decades, but I know him, his family and the church he founded in Florida personally. I want all the readers to know that you have totally misrepresented his teachings and if they sincerely desire to know this man or his ministry they should read his material and listen to his teaching for themselves. As for you, I pray that your eyes will be opened to the truth and that you will refrain from such poor judgment of Christ’s ministers. You have been sowing discord in the Body of Christ and not revealing heresy at all. Maybe you should check yourself before you wreck yourself by attacking God’s servants. I only pray that you still have at least some small measure of the fear of the Lord in you.
Let these scriptures speak to you…
“Do not speak evil of one another, brethren. He who speaks evil of a brother and judges his brother, speaks evil of the law and judges the law. But if you judge the law, you are not a doer of the law but a judge. There is one Lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy. Who are you to judge another?” James 4:11-12
Jesus said in His “Sermon on the Mount” in Matthew 7:1-2:
“Judge not, that you be not judged. 2 For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you.”
Stay busy following the teachings of Jesus. Take care of the sick, feed the hungry… etc.
I READ THIS BLOG WITH GREAT INTEREST. I HAVE BEEN UNDER THE TEACHING OF MANY OF THE PEOPLE MENTIONED. WAS IN A DISCIPLESHIP CHURCH [DEREK PRINCE WAS ONE OF THE 5-FOLD MINISTRY ALSO ERN BAXTER WHO ARE NOW DEAD AND CHARLES SIMPSON WHO IS STILL ALIVE–CAN’T REMEMBER THE OTHER TWO NOW. IN ANY EVENT THAT WAS 20 YEARS IN THE CHURCH. ALSO HAD 10 YEARS IN AN ECCLESIASTICAL CHURCH AND I HAD TO TERMINATE MY MEMBERSHIP THROUGH A MATHEW 18 PROCEDURE BECAUSE MEN IN LEADERSHIP IN THE CHURCH USURPED MY AUTHORITY [NOT THE MAN IN ADMINISTRATION WHO HONORED MY REQUEST] SO I AM NOW DIRECTLY UNDER THE LEADERSHIP OF MY ONLY TRUE FAMILY: GOD MY FATHER, JESUS MY HUSBAND/FRIEND, AND THE HOLY SPIRIT WHO LIVES IN ME. IT HAS BEEN AN EXCITING AND CHALLENGING JOURNEY BUT THANKS BE TO GOD THAT I HAVE BEEN “DELIVERED” FROM FALSE TEACHING AND OBEY THE ONLY TRUE GOD AS THE HOLY SPIRIT OPENS MY UNDERSTANDING TO HIS HOLY WORD. HOW ABOUT YOU? IF ANYONE RESPONDS TO THIS BLOG YOU NEED TO KNOW THAT WHATEVER I DO IS WITH MY TWO HANDS AND THE HELP OF GOD.
If it weren’t for the CI ministry, I would still be wandering around church to church, attending and giving tithe, reading the Bible and trying my very best to live up to Gods commandments. All along believing that I will be going to heaven; It was actions, going through the motions, but was it truly real?
No, in fact it was all very fake, and until I attended a CI church in Baltimore MD I never really knew God, let alone have a deep and personal relationship with him.
My reaction to this group was critical at first only because I didn’t believe that people can actually be this kind, humble, supportive, and loving toward total strangers. Now me being a “Christian” it’s sad to realize that I was skeptical as a result of this surprising behavior and acceptance.
In addition, there are people who are “false prophets” but the lord says these will be discerned by their fruits. Yes, many people will fall and follow these people, but I assure you CI is not in this category.
Personally, attending and applying these teachings of CI’s ministry, I myself have experienced and changing of myself unto Christ image. Am I saying that I am perfect, no, but when your outlook on life has completely changed, your love for strangers is just so overwhelming that you choke up to even think about all their suffering. Where you are satisfied, and so full of joy for life that you just burst out in laughter at the thought of where you have come from and where you are currently. To never fear where your needs will come from because you know the Lord has it covered. To hear the voice of God speak to you in such a “down to earth” way and as you listen and reflect you just stand in awe that through your obedience you see that you just missed a major catastrophe…
This is just a small portion of the joy and freedom that this ministry has brought to my life, it is so sad to think that even the highest levels of church authority have never experienced this.
So whoever, think what you will, but I suggest testing and discerning a ministry for yourself, and calling on God for an answer before coming to a final conclusion based on another’s opinions.
you try an attack bishop bill hammond your out of your tree . When you effect the body of christ like him in a positive way. Have you ever talked to bishop? Have you ever share your thelogical concerns. You need to go to his ministry share your concerns your being conformer accuser brethern.
Blessings,
I would like to share what I have found about CI and Hamon:
In his book “Prophets Pitfalls and Principles” page 59 (Spanish edition) he says that he “reports” to a College of Bishops. So I decided to find out who they were.
This is the College of Bishops from the International Communion of Charismatic Churches. One of their web sites says that (ciresourcecenter.com)
“Dr. Hamon is also the President and Founder of the Network of Prophetic Ministries, which was founded to train, equip and provide accountability for many of the prophets God is raising up. This position of oversight, involving hundreds of prophets, apostles and pastors, was recognized by his peers when he was unanimously confirmed as a Bishop among the College of Bishops of the International Communion of Charismatic Churches. This affiliation provides Dr. Hamon fellowship and mutual accountability among such outstanding men of God as: Earl Paulk, Benson Idahosa, John Meares and Robert McAllister. dr. Hamon is one of the Apostolic ministers within the Congress of elders of the Network of Christian Ministries.”
This organization (ICCC) was founded by the Vatican and it could probably still be controlled by it… visit the ICCC official site: http://www.theiccc.com/history.html (a few extracts from this page below)
“The political and social agendas of the organization are being achieved through the development of national and international Christian networks and coalitions.” – [[IC being one of them]]
“In 1975 David DuPlessis (known as Mr. Pentecost) was called upon by Pope Paul VI to create and mediate the Roman Catholic-Pentecostal Dialogues…David DuPlessis in 1976 brought into those dialogues Robert McAlister who was leading a major Pentecostal reformation in Brazil among Roman Catholics and Pentecostals alike….the pope saw it as a gesture of genuine desire to identify with the historical church and he defended the actions of the three Pentecostals and called for McAlister and DuPlessis to be brought before him for commissioning as bishops of special recognition and rights thereby establishing them both as direct descendants of apostolic succession….”
“Bishop McAllister acting as the Primate, and Bishop Meares functioning as the Prelate then proceeded to consecrate Bishop Benson Idahosa (placing him in the line of succession) who along with Earl Paulk formed the original College of Bishops”
“The International Communion of Charismatic Churches has continued to grow and expand around the globe and has recently made new strides in bridging the gap between the historical and spiritual church once again. As evidenced by the recent participation of the Monsignor of the Roman Catholic Church of Curacao in the Conference of the ICCC bishops the heritage of the Communion is intact.”
So, I am not against Catholics, but I am against what Catholic Church teaches because it is against the Bible.
God, the creator of aLL THINGS sees all, hears all…and will judge all men.
Those who truly fear God will be very careful not to grieve HIM.
Mind your own…….look at your own flaws……do not look at he splinter on your brother’s eyes because there is a log on your own.
God knows whatto do with BIll in case he is doing something wrong……..also with other so called preachers who are not preaching the truth……..but let God be God………..leave your concerns with Him……..if in case you are the wrong one……GOD WILL TRULY JUDGE YOU………….GOD WILL NOT SPARE YOU………
For your own sake………….pray !
Church, get outside the building and start having church where it counts, the lost aren’t banging the door down to get in. They want to see real , broken, humble Christianity at work, one that brings glory to jesus, not some mans works or regiousity. Stop tearing each other up and get your eyes and your vision on Jesus, the author and perfecter of your faith, your walk, your salvation.
You have no revelation. One scripture to back your attack of Bill Hamon. You need to devote your time on go after God not trying to be God. If Bill Hamon had been off a bit we would need to pray for him. I pray your eyes be open before the “touch not my anointed ” effects you.
Hi,
THere appears to be a widespread misunderstanding about our duty as Christians regarding judging others. We are to judge between good and evil; truth and error; good spirits and evil spirits. Paul even tells us how to do it!! Paul said that many have left the way of Truth and shipwrecked their faith because they listened to deceiving spirits and seducing spirits. We are called to correct, rebuke, exhort one another- to discern true doctrines from false doctrines, to pull our brother out of the fire!! That is our call and our duty.
If an doctrine doesn’t stand up to scriptural scrutiny, we are called to cast it out and warn others in love.
Jesus had harsh words for leaders who walked teaching error. He called other religious leaders “brood of vipers” “the blind leading the blind” “whitewashed tombs” He taught that love is Truth and that error is harmful.
THe Bible also teaches that there is a way that seems right to a man but it ends in destruction. Jesus came to show us the way- the only way, the only Truth, the only Gospel. He warns us to beware of other gospels, doctrines of demons, deceiving spirits, false teachers and that destruction awaits those who engage in it!! Holly’s warning is what love would do- it’s what Jesus would do, and it’s what Truth would do.
If we see our brother heading into the fire and pull him out we save him and if we don’t warn him, we share in his guilt!
Jesus said that we ought not to judge one another unfairly or hypocritically- that is the judgment we are told not to engage in: such as
thinking someone is a gossip and admonishing them when you do the same thing! Even then, though, we are to correct them, but only after we first confess and repent of our own sin. “first, pull the log out of your eye, THEN you can see clearly to pull the splinter out of your brother’s eye. We are SUPPOSED TO pull the splinter out of our brother’s eye, after we correct ourselves.
Love is not silent in the face of evil and error.
Instead of giving your opion on Dr. Hamon doctirnal views being heritical, why don’t you invite him to discuss your concerns on exactlly what he believes and what you believe.
Rather than trusting what anybody says. One should always ask God to show them the truth. My stance is… Lord, I know what this side says and what that side says. I see what your word says. Study it from cover to cover. Go to investagate. Take God with you. Again ask Him. He knows the Truth. He will show you if you get your ideas and man’s ideas out of the way. Let us not hender what the Spirt of the Living God is doing. Remember the Sadduesses and Pharasses? They also were against what Jesus was doing. Let us not do the same to the Holy Spirit. Let’s find out..what is God doing. God is a Big God. His ways are not our ways. Again…what is God doing theses days? Is He just twiddling His thumbs? I think not! He is building people with a purpose for a use, not just pew warmers.. I for one will following Him not flesh and blood only. I will hear and take what I hear to Him,The Spirit is who we should be listening closely to. What if God is moving and He is truely the creater of all this you hate. Did he say..if you are not with me, you are against me. I for one do not want to be against Him. I will search this thing out by the Spirit of God..who is the light of the world and the light that lights up man’s spirit. Give us eyes to see You Oh Lord..where You are and where You AINT!.
No Time To Waste Says:
March 19, 2007 at 9:32 am
david,
have you ever spoken with bill harmon personally?????
___________________________________
No Time to Waste:
One need not speak personally to Joseph Smith, or Herbert Armstrong, or Charles Darwin, or Charlie Manson to speak out about the lies they perpetrated upon the naïve. It is unrealistic to sit down and have a chat over coffee with every purveyor of deception that happens to crop up. If you don’t like being informed, then don’t troll websites that expose charlatans. There are many websites that are serving up the spiritual Kool-aid while God’s servants stand by and do nothing. You’d probably be happier posting there. I am grateful to informed Christians, such as Holly, who have the ability and fortitude to expose these false teachers. I just left a church the was pushing false teaching like there was no tomorrow. Thank God for His blessed Word, for the Holy Spirit’s guidance, and for the godly counsel of discernment and apologetics ministries, including Holly’s, that I was able to make an informed decision to finally leave. How interesting that “No Time To Waste” is your site name. Having chosen such a name, you of all folks should take into consideration that more time is wasted when Christians stumble unawares into false teachings. Had I known then what I know now, I would have spent more time learning Christian Doctrine than chasing after foolishness.
Thanks and God bless
a follower of Jesus Says:
April 26, 2007 at 1:38 am
I currently attend a church that is aligned with WLI, and in the last few years I have seen and heard doctrines that at first puzzled me, but now cause me great concern.
For instance, using Matt 28:19 “Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost” as a justification for attempting to take dominion over cities, institutions, even countries etc when the verse plainly refers to people of various ethnic groups and NOT nation states.
A Follower of Jesus,
I understand completely where you stand. Sitting through a service where these things are taught is like trying to pick the bones out of a mouthful of fish. There’s usually more bone than meat. It’s painful. I encourage you to pray and seek the Lord’s will for you. Your observations are valid and it seems that despite their false teaching you are able to discern the truth of God’s Word, and to desire the truth in your church’s teaching. I would venture to say that your discomfort with your church’s teachings is God’s way of calling you out of there and having you find a place that teaches sound doctrine. God bless you, follower. I will pray for you.
Kim Skivington,
You are word for word parroting the false doctrine of dominionists. The scriptures you quoted have been twisted by domionistst to say something different than what the bible teaches. Rightly divide the Word for yourself, and ask the Lord to reveal His truth. Read commentaries and studies from men of God who faithfully serve Him and hold to orthodox Christian doctrine. Seek counsel from godly, mature Christian people outside your church and see for yourself. Don’t just swallow everything dominionists shove down your throat. The end of times is coming, and so is the rapture. God bless you.
I have family who are members of a Christian international church, one which i have attended, I am concerned they are being misled, can anyone give proof of his doctorate.
Hello,
The Bible says, “You will know them by their fruit.” I believe this applies to everybody. Before judging Dr Bill Hamon and his doctrine, I think it’s helpful to maybe study who he really is, the ministry he is leading and the fruits of his life and ministry. In that way, we will find out if he is really an ordained prophet by the Lord or not.
God bless you all.
I read your post with dismay. I think you have never read any of Bill Hamon’s book, you only overhear what others say about him. Now let us face it: How come some of us claim to be right in doctrines whereas we are almost always wrong in character?
I dare say here that it is because of the ones who are supposed to lay the foundations for righteous Christian living, namely, the apostles and prophets according to the book Ephesians 2:20, are beign hampered by such insinuation against them. and how do they differentiate the fake and authentic currency in the banks. isnt it by being accustomed to the real ones? Likewise let us be keen to discern the real and false ministers by being accustomed to the real.
and the fact that someone is giving a strange doctrine, which maybe biblically sound does not mean he is a false prophet. We, in this ministry , have a very thin line to walk on since we know in part and prophesy in part 1Corinthians 13:9.
the essence of this all is to let them arise and correct them in love. wont it be wonderful to find out how this guys are receptive to correction and humbled by the fact that someone had the heart to correct them when they were wrong? Let it sink now that by blogging and claiming someone to be false is just gossip, and should instead be directed to the right person if you think he is wrong. you have his website, and you can as well contact him
Have you ever read Bill Hamon’s book “Prophets, Priciples and Pitfalls?”
I think all those disagreement would be solved if we understood that every apostle has a people to whom he has been sent. You may not even understand everything that an apostle says in a meeting while another person assimilates all and runs with and is blessed thereof. someone may be at sea on this subject whereas another is flowing with the doctrine of the apostle because it is to him/her the apostle is sent.
An example is when Peter, an apostle to the Jews went to a Gentile community, he caused confusion and had to be publicly rebuked by Paul (Galatians 2:14). Why? Because it was not His domain and these were not his supposed audience.
I have come to this conclusion after going through all the negative and the positive innuendos posted concerning this man of God.
Supposing you were there during the time of Elisha and you saw what he did to the folks who mocked his bald head, wouldnt you have concluded that he was from the devil himself (2 Kings 2:23,24)?
That is why it is wrong to judge the prophets by their strange ways of expression.
In this era of information it is important to pray God for guidance concerning the information you are getting and where you are getting it from. Maybe Bill Hamon is not sent to you and thus his ministry will always cause you to feel out of place or judgmental.
Hi. I appreciate that you are concerned about false doctrine in the church. I do have one disagreement with you though over the temptation of Eve to become like God if she would eat the fruit. I believe the deception was that Adam and Eve had already been created in God’s image and likeness, therefore the temptation was to act outside of faith in God in an attempt to obtain by human effort what had already been given. To act on that lie was to disbelieve God’s love and provision for them, to act out of doubt instead of faith, hence, sin. That is the definiton of Sin, according to the book of Hebrews; to attempt to obtain by works what God has already offered by grace. Eve’s best response would have been to quote the truth, that she was already like God by the fact she was created in his image. I think the problem you have with this concept is a matter of semantics. We are not saying we become like God by willing it so. We are saying that as sons and heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, we are of the same family as God and every child is made in the likeness of his or her parents. I do not find it heretical to believe so since the word is pretty clear on this. If we were trying to take what was not promised to us, then yes, that would be heresy and we would be like the one who said he would exalt his throne above the throne of God, but we are not saying that. Anyway, thanks for letting me share. Blessings.
I am amazed that we as christians still are the first to kill our own. Some of the venom I read here scares me. I guess love one another means nothing today. I wonder, are souls being saved at Bill’s meetings? If yes, maybe we should lighten up a bit.
Paul
Bill Hammon doesnt even remotely teach what this site claims, they are perverting his teachings wholeheartedly. what he does teach is that all christians can be filled with the Holy Spirit and walk in the power of God for the throwing down of strongholds and overcoming sin. To say that <r. Hammon is trying to raise up an end time army of prophets and apostles to physically subdue the earth is a lie and a complete perversion of what he is teaching. The bible says that wherever we set our foot we have dominion. it is speakinfg of spiritual dominion here not physical, and this is all Mr. Hammon is speaking of. Christians who take spiritual dominion wherever they go. If youy people dont have spiritual dominion wherever you go, perhaps you need deliverance from the religious demon that keeps you bound .
Amen Ed Blaize I agree with you. I have read several of Bill Hamon’s books and I have not read (directly or indirectly) any such idea that Apostles and Prophets will physically or emotionally “subdue” the other offices (evangelists, pastors and teachers). WE NEED ALL FIVE! Imagine a hand with just a thumb (Apostle, governs) and an index finger (Prophet, guides). IT COULDNT FUNCTION!!!! We need the middle finger (Evangelist, gatherer), Ring finger (Pastor, guardian) and Pinkey (Teacher, Grounder of the Truth). This is what Bill Hamon, Peter Wagner and other teach on and agree. REMEMBER THIS: HUMILITY IS THE KEY TO AUTHORITY, AND INTIMACY (WITH JESUS CHRIST VIA THE HOLY SPIRIT) IS KEY TO POWER.
Mr Blaize,
Kindly provide scripture (about the spiritual dominion, and deliverance from the religious demon). Since you are ministering, I assume your ministry is based on scripture.
Thank you, and God bless you.
Well I think that many miss-interepet the bible, even some on here. If we look at scripture we will see. Ephesian-4-11-13, (And He Jesus)gave some apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelist;and some, pastors,and some, teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a (perfect man)unto the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ. There-fore Jesus can not come back until this comes to pass, and it does not take a rocket scientist to see that this has not happen yet! Many believers are miss-lead by the scripture in 1-Corinthians-13-10, Which says: But that which is perfect is come, than that which is in part shall be done away.The perfect this scripture is talking about is not the written word of God, but it is talking about us becoming (perfect-mature)read verse 11 for yourself. Plus Amos-3-7, Says Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servents the prophets. Jesus is the Living word from Genesis to Revelation, in the bible! So he is the same yesturday today and for ever! So prophets and apostles are still in the earth revealing present truth to God’s people!
Kindly provide scripture (about the spiritual dominion, and deliverance from the religious demon). Since you are ministering, I assume your ministry is based on scripture.
Thank you, and God bless you.
in response to this statement i refer you directly to scripture.
all scripture quotes come from the King James Version on biblegateway.com. forgive me if it is rather long, lest i be accused of taking scripture out of context, i had to put entire sections in to make sure everything is in context.
1 Corinthians 12:1-11
1Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
2Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led.
3Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
4Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
5And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
6And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
7But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
8For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
9To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
10To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
11But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
this mentions the different gifts of the Holy spirit, something that the writers of this site OBVIOUSLY ignore and toss out of their belief system because their carnal minds cannot fathom such things.
Matthew 17:14-21
14And when they were come to the multitude, there came to him a certain man, kneeling down to him, and saying,
15Lord, have mercy on my son: for he is lunatick, and sore vexed: for ofttimes he falleth into the fire, and oft into the water.
16And I brought him to thy disciples, and they could not cure him.
17Then Jesus answered and said, O faithless and perverse generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him hither to me.
18And Jesus rebuked the devil; and he departed out of him: and the child was cured from that very hour.
19Then came the disciples to Jesus apart, and said, Why could not we cast him out?
20And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
21Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting.
here Jesus obviously cast a demon out of a child.
Luke 9:1-6
1Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases.
2And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.
3And he said unto them, Take nothing for your journey, neither staves, nor scrip, neither bread, neither money; neither have two coats apiece.
4And whatsoever house ye enter into, there abide, and thence depart.
5And whosoever will not receive you, when ye go out of that city, shake off the very dust from your feet for a testimony against them.
6And they departed, and went through the towns, preaching the gospel, and healing every where.
here Jesus gave his disciples power and authority (dominion) over sickness and devils(spirits). this is a verse referring to spiritual dominion.
Luke 10:1-21 pay close attention to lines 9 & 16-20
1After these things the LORD appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come.
2Therefore said he unto them, The harvest truly is great, but the labourers are few: pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he would send forth labourers into his harvest.
3Go your ways: behold, I send you forth as lambs among wolves.
4Carry neither purse, nor scrip, nor shoes: and salute no man by the way.
5And into whatsoever house ye enter, first say, Peace be to this house.
6And if the son of peace be there, your peace shall rest upon it: if not, it shall turn to you again.
7And in the same house remain, eating and drinking such things as they give: for the labourer is worthy of his hire. Go not from house to house.
8And into whatsoever city ye enter, and they receive you, eat such things as are set before you:
9And heal the sick that are therein, and say unto them, The kingdom of God is come nigh unto you.
10But into whatsoever city ye enter, and they receive you not, go your ways out into the streets of the same, and say,
11Even the very dust of your city, which cleaveth on us, we do wipe off against you: notwithstanding be ye sure of this, that the kingdom of God is come nigh unto you.
12But I say unto you, that it shall be more tolerable in that day for Sodom, than for that city.
13Woe unto thee, Chorazin! woe unto thee, Bethsaida! for if the mighty works had been done in Tyre and Sidon, which have been done in you, they had a great while ago repented, sitting in sackcloth and ashes.
14But it shall be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon at the judgment, than for you.
15And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted to heaven, shalt be thrust down to hell.
16He that heareth you heareth me; and he that despiseth you despiseth me; and he that despiseth me despiseth him that sent me.
17And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name.
18And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
19Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.
20Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven.
21In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.
line 19 is one verse where i get spiritual dominion from,(there are many more) this is obviously referring to dominion over all power of the enemy,(demonic spiritual power) and talking about treading on the enemy, (where we set our feet)
Mathew 4:23-24
23And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.
24And his fame went throughout all Syria: and they brought unto him all sick people that were taken with divers diseases and torments, and those which were possessed with devils, and those which were lunatick, and those that had the palsy; and he healed them.
these two verses only illustrate that part of the gospel of the kingdom is to heal the sick and cast out devils, and lest you believe only Jesus could do it and not us, verses that disprove that belief follow.
Mark 16:14-20
14Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
15And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
16He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
19So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.
20And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.
Line 17-20 clearly states that these signs will be with your ministry if you follow Him and BELIEVE! believing is a prerequisite to seeing, and line 20 even says He will confirm our words about Him with SIGNS following. meaning laying on of hands and healing the sick, casting out devils etc.etc. mentioned in the above passages. So if these signs arent following your ministries, you may want to start believing what the word says and stop listening to the teachings of man.
Here is the clincher where Jesus says we will do even greater works than he did. also mentions the Holy Spirit coming into us and dwelling in us.
John 14:12-17
12Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
13And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
14If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.
15If ye love me, keep my commandments.
16And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
17Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
one more set of scriptures that God says he gives us power through the Holy spirit follows.
Ephesians 1:17-23
17That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
18The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,
19And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,
20Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,
21Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:
22And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
23Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.
It is very clear here that through Jesus we have power and dominion because no other name on earth or heaven has more power, and God gives us, his church body, exceeding greatness of his power. in His fullness.
Now i say everything is a spiritual battle, not a physical one, if any oppose you, you are being apposed by the spirit in them, and to prove this, and to help you understand itual battles and how to deal with them here is some scriptures dealing with it.
Ephesians 6:10-24
10Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.
11Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
12For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
13Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
14Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
15And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
16Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
17And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:
18Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;
19And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,
20For which I am an ambassador in bonds: that therein I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak.
21But that ye also may know my affairs, and how I do, Tychicus, a beloved brother and faithful minister in the Lord, shall make known to you all things:
22Whom I have sent unto you for the same purpose, that ye might know our affairs, and that he might comfort your hearts.
23Peace be to the brethren, and love with faith, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.
24Grace be with all them that love our Lord Jesus Christ in sincerity. Amen.
Now i exhort whoever is reading this and claims to be a follower of Christ, start following Christ and His words and teachings rather than the teachings of men that prevent you from being filled with the Power of God through his Holy Spirit. Have a nice day!
nearly every scripture above talking about the manifest power of God comes with a prerequisite, and that is to believe. perhaps the reason so many people dont see the power of God manifest in these ways is that they dont believe, they are essentially unbelievers in regards to these scriptures, but God said we live by EVERY word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God, not some words, not a few words, but EVERY word. people tell on themselves in this regard, when i quote one of these scriptures, they say ” I dont believe that” well, no kidding, if you did, these signs would follow you and your ministry too. see believing is essential and key to seeing the Kingdom of heaven and the power of God, i just ask people to stop trying to argue with each other, and if you dont believe something someone is doing because you were taught in your tradition it is wrong, then ignore your tradition of men, and search the scripture to see if you find evidence for what the people are saying, and then pray for the Lord to give you divine wisdom in the area so you know what is true. thats why the bible says the Holy Spirit will lead you into all truth. you shouldnt be getting your knowledge of the bible from men anyway, you should have a personel relationship with Jesus, the creator of the universe, and through His Holy Spirit he will teach you everything. read it for yourselves and stop listening to people.
Mr Blaize,
Thank you for your reply. I just wanted to know where you were coming from based on scripture. Turns out, you made a couple of assumptions about my beliefs that were a bit off. I will try to address them here. Please know that I am not trying to argue with you. I enjoy communicating with other believers, and I learn quite a lot from this kind of give-and-take. I hope you get something from it, as well.
One of your most striking rebukes is that one should not be taking knowledge from other men, and that one should rely (solely?) on the Holy Spirit for guidance. I read and study scripture and I constantly pray for the Lord’s wisdom and the Holy Spirit’s guidance. While I don’t rely on others to spoon feed me doctrine, I have been greatly edified and blessed by my pastor and other godly pastors, teachers and apologists. As well as I can, I filter everything I learn through scripture. Scripture doesn’t require us to study scripture without someone’s assistance or teaching. Jesus taught the apostles, the apostles taught others, and the gospel has been perpetuated by the church, through the Holy Spirit, in just that manner. I think it’s fair to say that we all begin somewhere and under someone’s wing. Since you are a defender of Mr Hamon, I presume you subscribe to his teachings and traditions. I find it interesting that you require others to meet an unscriptural standard you probably don’t (and are not required to) meet.
We are in agreement in that scripture is truth. According to the scriptures, the gifts of the Spirit are factual. They are scriptural, but some interpretations of them are not. You apparently think I don’t believe in the gifts of the spirit. Just to clarify, I do believe in them, but I also know that many weak, “carnal” Christians are apt to misuse them for their own edification and not the Church’s; and for their glory rather than God’s. For this reason, I don’t believe every “prophet” or “apostle” who comes down the pike and claims their signs and wonders, or their new spin on the historic doctrine, are a genuine “work of the spirit.” I rely on scripture and on the fruit of that individual. To this day, I have personally observed the gifts of the Spirit manifest themselves powerfully in the most mundane ways–in the faithfulness of the “church ladies” who labor diligently for God’s glory; in the abilities of every preacher, teacher, pastor, evangelist, prayer partner, and servant of Christ who bears witness to the Gospel of Christ. I’ve seen people who were hopelessly lost, saved. I’ve seen people healed, and I’ve seen the power of God sustain those who God chose not to heal. Bottom-line: The gifts of the Spirit are for God’s glory. 1 Cor lays it all out, and that’s what I believe.
As for demon possession and demonic activity, you are preaching to the choir. I believe that spiritual warfare is true and very real, first and foremost because scripture bears witness to it. I know we live in world that is as much natural as supernatural. I know and have seen the destruction Satan wreaks on this world and in the lives of individuals. I have seen the effects of demon oppression as well as possession. Nevertheless, the true litmus test is not in my personal experiences or those of others, but in the truth of scripture.
I believe God can and does perform miracles through His servants. Signs and wonders accompanied the first century church, and as a result, the church grew exponentially. Signs and wonders were God’s way of endorsing His original apostles as they ministered to the un-believing. Is it still possible for God’s people to perform signs and wonders? Yes — I personally believe it is. I believe God can do marvelous things through His vessels if He chooses. It is possible, but I don’t believe it is normative.
Even when He chooses to grace us with miracles, signs and wonders, scripture indicates that He is probably not going to work through people with errant doctrines who seek to glorify themselves rather than God. Sometimes I wonder why some Christians, who supposedly believe in the totality of scripture, doggedly demand signs and wonders. As if the power of Christ to change an unregenerate life isn’t wondrous enough! Christ, not signs and wonders, is the manifest power of God.
Although you have made the presumption, I am not given to men’s preconceived notions or unscriptural traditions. Scripture tells us that there will be wolves in sheeps clothing who will deceive with error and corrupt doctrine. This is why I study scripture and do what I can to avoid following those who are unfaithful to scripture.
I’m simply a grateful follower of Christ and this is what I believe: I believe I am a wretched sinner undeservedly saved by the grace of Christ. I believe in the power of God to save. I believe that belief leads to obedience in Christ. Belief is not something I can conjure up, in and of myself, but like faith, repentence, and grace, through the Holy Spirit, it is a gift from God. I believe that God is sovereign, and that His will drives us — not the other way around. I believe that Jesus–not the church–will usher His Kingdom and that He will rule forever. I believe in the power and authority of Christ, and I am pleased just to be His slave. I believe that the Holy Spirit resides in me, and that it is impossible for any power of darkness to overtake me, because God is faithful to keep His sheep. Your assumption that believers who don’t see your viewpoint don’t really believe, or that we have a substandard relationship with Christ, or that we are somehow under the influence of religion or errant teaching is a bit odd to me. I agree that the Word of God ought to be taken totally, because it is truth — all of it — is truth. Because of the work of the Holy Spirit in my life, I don’t need to petulantly hang on the prospect of power and authority, or signs and wonders. I don’t need to limit my belief to the temporal or carnal benefits of being a servant of Christ. True belief transcends all that. True Belief requires obedience to Christ; it requires willingness to take up the cross to follow Him. I believe in God because He’s God, and I have seen His power in my life and in the lives of others who were hopelessly lost. I believe in the scriptures because they bear witness to God’s glory — not man’s. I think maybe we (and every believer) can find agreement in that.
Although I think your rebuke of me and others who challenge your viewpoint is misplaced, I thank you for taking the time to reply. I encourage you to look deeper into what it really means to believe. Re-read the scriptures you cited, this time concentrating less on power, authority, and the outward benefits of operating in the power of Christ(which are valid), and more on the less glamourous concepts of obedience and sacrifice; evangelism, love and servant-hood. Afterall, Jesus didn’t come to give us special abilities, signs and wonders. He came to save us from hell. In humility and love, He modeled perfect obedience to the will of His Father and compelled us to do the same. He equipped us with the Holy Spirit to enable us to obey His commands — not just so we could perform signs and wonders.
Anyway, I hope this is helpful to you. Thanks again, and may God bless you!
I totally agree with Herb…we should stop worrying so much about what others are doing and concentrate on their walk with the LORD. The Bible says in Philipians 2:12 to “…work out your own salvation with fear and trembling”. Let God take care of the deceivers….
Reading this makes me wonder what the “church” is doing with it’s time. As 1Cor. 14 says about prophets, that they are subject to other prophets as far as truth and accuracy. As for the test, the true prophets speak the word of God. If it comes to pass, then someone was listening, weren’t they? If it doesn’t come to pass then the “fruit” is not good. Is it? As far as my experience with Dr. Hamon goes, he has prophesied to me, events that were to happen in my life and so far they have come to pass. Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater. Take what is good and true, line it up with the word of God and if it doesn’t line up, then you know what’s what. I find a lot of people going around nitpicking when we should be evangelizing, prophesying,(the Apostle Paul said that he’d rather have you prophecy than speak in tongues) and doing and loving people into the kingdom of God. Unless Dr. Hamon has changed his theology and beliefs and hasn’t notified anybody then please “Do not judge lest you be judged”. I don’t want to be in the shoes of those who judge when the time comes. God will take care of the false prophet. In the meantime we should work out our own salvation with fear and trembling as stated in the Word.
Hey guys. No where in the bible does it say to accuse your brother. Do you know Bill Hammon personaly? I have gained much from his teaching about the power within…to pray in tongues and release prophecy…Every Cd I’ve listened to has been great…now concerning future events give grace because these things are starting to happen now..the bride of christ IS arising in a greater anointing…Mike Bickles Friends of the bride groom ministry…there are more miracles happening through christians now than ever before. I have even prayed and seen people healed and delivered. There is a stronger anointing rising in me..The end time shifting has begun..so know that anyone who may try and articulate these coming events could change the way they articulate it as they get more revelation…there is more revelation coming all the time..take what one man of God says and another..listen to John Paul Jackson in his Perfect storm message or others…It does not build up to criticize your brothers…that is partnering with the enemy who is the chief accuser. In HIS grace Jan
are you sure that you arent fighting God himself?kindly,only belive in what you read from Gods word because only the spirit of the unti-christ fights against the will of the God of heavens.
I believe those who write posts condemning prophets and the charismatic are either
1. Ignorant (1 Cor 12:1)
2. Severely messed up by false cessationist doctrines (Eph 4:8-11)
3. Influenced by the enemy to be persecutors of Full Gospel Ministers (John 8:44)
“Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.” 1 Corinthians 14:39
“But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.” Gal 4:29
Paul
Hello to all those who question C. Peter Wagner and Bill Hamon:
HAVE YOU GUYS ACTUALLY READ THEIR WORK? OR ARE YOU JUDGING PRESUMPTUOUSLY?
I have read and discerned the Apostolic and Prophetic movement EXTENSIVELY for the past two years, and I can say that both these authors, plus a multitude of others do not exalt the Apostolic or Prophetic office any higher than the others mentioned in Ephesians 4:11. Just like the Trinity of the God-head (God the Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit) is needed because they all FUNCTION DIFFERENTLY AND HAVE DIFFERENT ROLES, we need the FIVE-FOLD MINISTRY in the church today to build, equip, exhort, and train new and current believers in Christ until they measure to the fullness of the stature of Christ (Eph. 4:11-14). God is our Father our Creator. Jesus Christ is our Mediator, our Pathway to Salvation, and the Holy Spirit is our Teacher, our Comforter. They all play different roles, although they are all ONE.
The Five-fold extension of Christ Himself works the same way. Apostles build/plant Churches, “father” believers, labor to train, build, send believers, and encourage unity in the body. Prophets discern vision and God’s “blueprint” for a people (church, nation, etc) according to their “sphere of authority”. They also work closely with Apostles (Eph. 2:11) to build and exhort the church. They prophesy, guide, correct, admonish (all in true Christ-like love) those they oversee in order to build up those whom they oversee. Evangelists gather the people, promote Salavation thru the Gospel, perform signs and miracles to heal and bless the people and show Christ’s love to the World. Pastors counsel, guard, shepherd and protect their flock and are responsible for their group. Teachers train, equip and plant the Truth of God’s word to the belivers, paving the way for their future in Christ. ALL FIVE ARE NEEDED IN THE BODY OF CHRIST! Also look at David Cannistraci, John A. Tetsola, John Eckhardt, Michael Scantleberry, Nancy Kaplan, etc. Read about them too. I love everyone here. I love the Body of Christ and His will is for us to be in unity, not looking at each other, but on Him. As for any accusation, we look at their lives as evidence of who they are inside (i.e. their fruit). Paul said for us to be fruit inspectors in the Body to watch for the False Teachers and other “false” five-fold Eph 4:11 ministers. According to my study, I have not found such bad fruit from Wagner or Hamon. Study what God is doing in the Body today, as the Holy Spirit presses forward to [Acts 3:21] gain restitution of all things and be the Body that God has called us to be! Amen…
I don’t agree with you. several years ago I had a friend, he receive Jesus Christ as his savior, but he did’nt agree with charismatic movement, and speaking in tounge. You know, he is now be mouslim (islam). I don’t who you are. May be you are like my friend jugde Pastor Bill Hamon, or like Parish jugde Jesus Christ. I hope not. God Bless you
Siblings in Christ: The Bereans were more noble than these in that they continued to search the Scriptures to see if these (teachings of Paul, who they appreciated) were true.
Revel
I am a licensed minister with Chriatian International and I’m, quite frankly, stunned with all this misinformation about Bill Hamon!!! I have been involved with this ministry since l993 and this is the first negative report I have ever heard. I advise reading his Scripturally supported books for yourselves!!! These quotes are so taken out of context. Everything Bill Hamon has ever taught is right out of Scripture. I have a master’s degree from a conservative Baptist seminary and I know hermeneutic principles. Anybody can say anything they want to, but it takes a discerning person to check out for yourselves these false accusations. I can tell you what I read above is flatly error concerning this great man of God. Torch PS. You will be held accountable before God for your slander!
I am a follower of jesus too, but i also say judge not lest you be judge for all make mistakes and if you continue to judge others by anything but the word of God beware what you speak!!
Guys n Gals watch out!!!
Do not believe everything on the internet, examine yourself first, examine the people writing.
Ask God if in doubt, instead of simply judging others.
Here more so, if Bill is indeed from God, you would be judged more severly, why risk?
I read comments like these and took them seriously and missed one the blessings.
be careful to distinguish between the voice of accuser and God, and let go’s voice prevail.
In case you want to learn on how to hear God’s voice try this.
http://www.daveroberson.org/series.aspx?id=402
It is said that Christians like you are so intimidated from the call of God in other people. Maybe you should concentrate in your call and edify the body of Christ instead of dividing and pointing fingers at such wonderful people. Shame on You!!!
YOU KNOW WHAT? ALL OF YOU WHO ARE AGAINST THE MAN OF GOD ARE JUDGING HIM AND THERE FOR YOU WILL BE JUDGED, I’VE FOLLOWED HIM FOR YEARS AND THE BIBLE SAY TO TRY THE SPIRITS AND SEE IF IT BE OF GOD, AND THAT’S WHAT I DID AND FOUND NO FAULT IN HIM OR HIS WIFE ALL OF YOU WHO ARE AGAINST HIM IS OF THE DEVIL AND ALLOWING JEZEBEL TO USE YOU BECAUSE SHE HATE’S PROPHETS ANYWAY YOU WANT TO SLAY HIM AND HIS MINISTRY I SAY LET GOD ARISE AND LET HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED AND A SPIRIT OF JEALOUSY AND ENVY IS OPERATING THROUGH YOU AND YOU NEED TO REPENT IN JESUS NAME!
You all should go back and read your bibles carefully with the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Those of you who are against Bill Hamon, be careful with the words that come out from your mouth because the word of God says ‘Do not touch my annointed’